Walter's proposal (Fire Ext)

Walter's proposal (Fire Ext)

Postby walterclark » Mon Dec 14, 2009 8:40 pm

This is where mine is as of right now. Subject to changes of course... This addresses the needed clarification regarding the requirement for a portable extinguisher in ALL vehicles, adds a restriction that Don enforces - at least on production based cars - regarding mounting extinguishers in the driver footwell, and includes additional mounting requirements for extinguishers over 2.5 pounds net. These may not all end up in the final proposal.

Technical and Safety Requirements, Section 4.B.

Present wording:

4. COCKPIT
.
.
B. Fire Extinguisher
1. 2.5-lb minimum A-B-C type or 1.25-lb Halon or approved substitute; must
be fully charged; must have a gauge.
2. Shall be securely mounted with catch to side or rear. No plastic straps,
catches, or brackets. Must not be mounted behind the driver and should
be mounted as low and as far forward as possible. Should be mounted
within reach of the driver.
3. Onboard fire system may be used, and is required in any car with a nitrous
system. Must be SCCA approved. A hand held bottle is also required.


Proposed:

4. COCKPIT
.
.
B. Fire Extinguisher minimum requirements.
1. All vehicles must be equipped with at least one portable 2.5-lb net minimum A-B-C type, 1.25-lb net Halon or approved substitute. It must be fully charged and must have a gauge.
2. All portable extinguishers shall be securely mounted with latch(s) positioned to side or rear of the vehicle. Portable extinguishers must not be mounted directly behind the driver or on the floor in the driver footwell if the car is equipped with suspended pedals. It should be mounted as low and as far forward as possible within reach of the driver. Additional extinguishers may be mounted beyond the driver’s immediate reach. No plastic straps, latches, or brackets are permitted. 2.5-lb net and smaller extinguishers may use a single latching metal strap, those over 2.5-lb net must have at least 2 metal straps.
3. An onboard fire system may be installed in addition to the portable, and is required in any car with a nitrous system. This system must be SCCA and/or FIA approved.
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Re: 2010 Season Rules Proposals

Postby britracer89 » Thu Dec 17, 2009 8:53 pm

What do you think of the bracket at link below?

HD 5lbs bracket:

http://www.brooksequipment.com/Fire_Ext ... kets/861HA
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Re: 2010 Season Rules Proposals

Postby walterclark » Thu Dec 17, 2009 9:22 pm

I think it is for a 5 lb extinguisher and has one strap.
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Re: 2010 Season Rules Proposals

Postby britracer89 » Fri Dec 18, 2009 10:03 am

Right. But it has bottom and additional side support with heavy duty strap and link. And is not the typical light weight sheetmetal bracket. I don't like the idea of having to modify a piece of equipment that is already designed for a particular job. I did find one bracket with 2 straps with government specs. I assume it is a military spec. Rated for 1.25g load. The web site is currently under re-construction so I can't give a link. I got the info from a local fire extinguisher co in Woonsocket, RI the other day.
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Re: Walter's proposal (Fire Ext)

Postby walterclark » Fri Dec 18, 2009 12:01 pm

Amerex makes 2 models for their 5 pound extinguishers with 2 straps 821S and 846. That 861HA may be better made than a single strap piece from Home Depot but clearly Amerex sees a need for 2 straps...maybe in a vehicle going end over end or into the trees, where one impact isnt the end of the stress.
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Re: Walter's proposal (Fire Ext)

Postby Rabbit Farmer » Fri Dec 18, 2009 1:54 pm

I'm thinking that a cylinder (or two rings) that the bottom 1/2 or 3/4 of the fire ext. slips into it with the clamp at the top 1/2 or 1/4 of the exposed end would be quite effective. Not suggesting a rule change, just thinking out loud.... might be over-engineering it to Mad Max specs.
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Re: Walter's proposal (Fire Ext)

Postby walterclark » Tue Dec 22, 2009 7:54 pm

I see the point. Straps are not the only way to safely secure these.

I need to think about how to simply and clearly alter the wording to allow things like something at the bottom of the cylinder that retains the bottom, and is not a strap, without implying the little fork of flimsy metal that sometimes locates the neck of the bottle is somehow acceptable as the second "thing".
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Re: Walter's proposal (Fire Ext)

Postby walterclark » Mon Dec 28, 2009 9:18 am

I have been working some on rewording my proposal. I want to allow alternatives to "2 metal straps" for larger than 2.5lb net extinguishers, further improve clarity of this section, and revise and update the onboard system statement to remove SCCA - which does not specify or certify onboard systems and correctly reference the SFI and FIA who do.


4. COCKPIT
.
.
B. Fire Extinguisher minimum requirements
1. Type. All vehicles must be equipped with at least one portable 2.5-lb net minimum A-B-C type, 1.25-lb net Halon or approved substitute. It must be fully charged and must have a gauge.
2. Portable installation. All portable extinguishers shall be securely mounted with latch(s) positioned to side or rear of the vehicle. Portable extinguishers must not be mounted directly behind the driver or on the floor in the driver footwell (if the car is equipped with suspended pedals). It should be mounted as low and as far forward as possible within reach of the driver. Additional extinguishers may be mounted beyond the driver’s immediate reach. No non-metal or elastic straps, latches, or brackets are permitted. Brackets for 2.5-lb net and smaller extinguishers may use a single latching metal strap to secure the extinguisher tank to the bracket. Extinguishers over 2.5-lb net must have at least one additional metal restraining feature that secures the tank of the extinguisher to the bracket, not including any bracket feature used to locate the control valve or neck of the tank to the bracket. The additional restraint(s) may consist of a second strap, a receiver on the bracket to secure the bottom of the tank, or a similar device and should still permit rapid removal of the extinguisher.
3. Onboard systems. An onboard fire system may be installed in addition to the portable, and is required in any car with a nitrous system. This system must be SFI 17.1 compliant and/or FIA Technical List #16 listed.
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Re: Walter's proposal (Fire Ext)

Postby bikeman » Thu Feb 04, 2010 10:03 pm

If I am reading this correctly, this means that fire extinguishers mounted on the floor in the standard manner would not be legal, because the latch would open upward, rather than sideways or to the rear.

Is this what is intended? If not, can someone point out the error in my interpretation? If so, what is the issue of upward latch openings that is not seen with sideways latch openings?

Thanks
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Re: Walter's proposal (Fire Ext)

Postby walterclark » Thu Feb 04, 2010 10:47 pm

If I am reading this correctly, this means that fire extinguishers mounted on the floor in the standard manner would not be legal, because the latch would open upward, rather than sideways or to the rear.

Is this what is intended? If not, can someone point out the error in my interpretation? If so, what is the issue of upward latch openings that is not seen with sideways latch openings?


Good question. I lifted that part from the existing without completely understanding the limits of what the authors intended. I hope one will speak up.

My personal opinon is that the intent of the statement was to have extinguishers brackets mounted so as to avoid positoning the latches forward. Not including 'up' in the acceptable directions may have been an oversight.
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